New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Woe unto you that bought the first model year of a major remake, perhaps this section can help address any 2014 and later model Ural "imperfections". Here's a special section for folks with the latest rigs to discuss 2014 and later model-related topics such fuel injection, 3-wheel disc brakes, hydraulic steering dampers, spin-on oil filters and other anomalies that don't belong on true Russsian motorcycle ;-P We've gone from using big hammers and greasy wrenches to needing computers and Ouija boards in order to fix our rigs.
Forum rules
Please keep this section specific to issues pertaining to 2014 and later models such as fuel injection, sidecar and rear disc brakes and so forth. Ask general or non-2014 and later specific questions in the main Hammerin' & Wrenchin' section.
Donbmw
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 306
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:47 pm
Location: Monroe, Louisiana, 71203

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by Donbmw » Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:40 pm

wooden nickel wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:23 pm
Timer is just a delay on. It just means the switch has to be on for at least the delay time before the indicator lights up. Even if the gas is sloshing slow, the indicator still won't flash any quicker than the time delay. That isn't too clear. What I mean is that I have my delay set to 5 seconds. The sensor has to be uncovered for at least 5 seconds before the indicator lights up and then even if the gas just splashes on the sensor, the light stays off for at least 5 seconds.
It at least stops the rapid blinking and it also means the gas is actually getting low before I get any blinking. I run it that low so seldom, I have to think for a few seconds to remember what the weird indicator light means.
This is not about the old style fuel sensor. It is about the new float fuel sensor they are installing to replace to optical one.
2015 Patrol, 1980 R65, 1982 R65 bought new, 1975 R 90/6, 1959TR3 Triumph

Don

User avatar
windmill
Order of Victory
Order of Victory
Posts: 7449
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:17 am
Location: Kent, Wa

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by windmill » Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:05 pm

Donbmw wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:40 pm
wooden nickel wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:23 pm
Timer is just a delay on. It just means the switch has to be on for at least the delay time before the indicator lights up. Even if the gas is sloshing slow, the indicator still won't flash any quicker than the time delay. That isn't too clear. What I mean is that I have my delay set to 5 seconds. The sensor has to be uncovered for at least 5 seconds before the indicator lights up and then even if the gas just splashes on the sensor, the light stays off for at least 5 seconds.
It at least stops the rapid blinking and it also means the gas is actually getting low before I get any blinking. I run it that low so seldom, I have to think for a few seconds to remember what the weird indicator light means.
This is not about the old style fuel sensor. It is about the new float fuel sensor they are installing to replace to optical one.
From what he explained, it shouldn't matter which sensor is used as it doesn't change how sloshing fuel effects them, it changes how long the sensor needs to be activated before the light comes on.
Barry

"Take care, sir," cried Sancho. "Those over there are not giants but windmills".

2007 Patrol 100k km and counting,
2018 M70

User avatar
Mr Wazzock
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 5156
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 8:22 pm
Location: Boston, UK
Contact:

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by Mr Wazzock » Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:32 pm

Donbmw wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:28 am
But know it is not going out when the tank is full.
Seems like it's stuck?
Mike H
2016 Ural cT, in glorious terracotta
(aka Oranzhevaya Opasnost, "The Orange Peril")

Donbmw
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 306
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:47 pm
Location: Monroe, Louisiana, 71203

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by Donbmw » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:17 pm

Mr Wazzock wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:32 pm
Donbmw wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:28 am
But know it is not going out when the tank is full.
Seems like it's stuck?
I have thought that it maybe. Every now and then it will go of but come back on. I am going to try and almost run out of gas and take the bike to work. Will use a borescope an see if there is something in the tank letting it get hung. It worked for almost 3 months then 3 weeks ago it has been staying on steady with occasionally going off and back on.
2015 Patrol, 1980 R65, 1982 R65 bought new, 1975 R 90/6, 1959TR3 Triumph

Don

User avatar
Tomcatfixer
Commissar
Commissar
Posts: 6967
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2015 5:10 am
Location: Gordonsville, VA

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by Tomcatfixer » Wed Feb 27, 2019 6:10 pm

It worked for almost 3 months then 3 weeks ago it has been staying on steady with occasionally going off and back on.
Sounds like a poor electrical connection to me. Have you checked your wiring?
- Chad

Gordonsville, Virginia, USA

Current rides:
2015 Ural cT "Mobile Chernobyl", 2001 Ural Patrol "The Patrol", 1999 Ural Tourist "The RPOC", 1994 Honda VFR750F

Previous rides:
2007 Honda VTR1000 FireStorm (Super Hawk in U.S.)
2001 Buell Blast! - - - - - - - 2005 Yamaha FJR1300
1993 Honda CBR600F2 - -1984 Yamaha FJ1100
Two different 1986 Yamaha FZX700S Fazers

User avatar
wooden nickel
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 2254
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:55 pm
Location: Louisville, KY 40216

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by wooden nickel » Wed Feb 27, 2019 7:30 pm

One of the problems with small float sensors is that the small float don't have the mass to push past any fouling or varnish. I know the early floats Ural used were also at an angle which would exacerbate the problem. I am not saying this is happening. I am just saying small float switches are more susceptible to any impediments than the larger units. Designing small, rugged, relatively inexpensive, fuel compatible sensors is a tough game.
I may not be good, but I'm slow.
Nick
2014 M70 Retros, the sports car of Urals.

Donbmw
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 306
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:47 pm
Location: Monroe, Louisiana, 71203

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by Donbmw » Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:13 pm

Tomcatfixer wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 6:10 pm
It worked for almost 3 months then 3 weeks ago it has been staying on steady with occasionally going off and back on.
Sounds like a poor electrical connection to me. Have you checked your wiring?
Yes I have checked the connections. No amount of playing with the plug and wiring would make the light go on and off. When the dealer installed the new switch they solder wires on the plug from the old sensor.
2015 Patrol, 1980 R65, 1982 R65 bought new, 1975 R 90/6, 1959TR3 Triumph

Don

User avatar
windmill
Order of Victory
Order of Victory
Posts: 7449
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:17 am
Location: Kent, Wa

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by windmill » Sat Mar 02, 2019 2:03 pm

wooden nickel wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:23 pm
Timer is just a delay on. It just means the switch has to be on for at least the delay time before the indicator lights up. Even if the gas is sloshing slow, the indicator still won't flash any quicker than the time delay. That isn't too clear. What I mean is that I have my delay set to 5 seconds. The sensor has to be uncovered for at least 5 seconds before the indicator lights up and then even if the gas just splashes on the sensor, the light stays off for at least 5 seconds.
It at least stops the rapid blinking and it also means the gas is actually getting low before I get any blinking. I run it that low so seldom, I have to think for a few seconds to remember what the weird indicator light means.
I ordered the timer, If possible could you show how you wired the timer?

Image
Barry

"Take care, sir," cried Sancho. "Those over there are not giants but windmills".

2007 Patrol 100k km and counting,
2018 M70

User avatar
wooden nickel
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 2254
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:55 pm
Location: Louisville, KY 40216

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by wooden nickel » Sat Mar 02, 2019 6:57 pm

It's been awhile Barry. Let me see if I can find it.
I may not be good, but I'm slow.
Nick
2014 M70 Retros, the sports car of Urals.

User avatar
wooden nickel
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 2254
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:55 pm
Location: Louisville, KY 40216

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by wooden nickel » Sat Mar 02, 2019 7:33 pm

Bad news Barry, I checked and that is the timer I ordered when I was getting an inverted function sensor. I couldn't get it to work without adding another relay. I ordered this relay from Bulgaria.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Delay-Time-Rel ... 364592646f
Any 12 volt straight on delay relay will work.
I may not be good, but I'm slow.
Nick
2014 M70 Retros, the sports car of Urals.

User avatar
windmill
Order of Victory
Order of Victory
Posts: 7449
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:17 am
Location: Kent, Wa

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by windmill » Sat Mar 02, 2019 7:49 pm

Interesting, its listed as functioning as either a No or NC relay.
Barry

"Take care, sir," cried Sancho. "Those over there are not giants but windmills".

2007 Patrol 100k km and counting,
2018 M70

User avatar
wooden nickel
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 2254
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:55 pm
Location: Louisville, KY 40216

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by wooden nickel » Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:13 pm

Yeah it does that but if I remember correctly, it doesn't just turn on after being triggered for a set time. I forget how it screwed me up but I know it was more efficient to start over rather than make that one work.
I may not be good, but I'm slow.
Nick
2014 M70 Retros, the sports car of Urals.

User avatar
windmill
Order of Victory
Order of Victory
Posts: 7449
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:17 am
Location: Kent, Wa

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by windmill » Sat Mar 02, 2019 10:18 pm

Played it safe and canceled it, and ordered 5A timer, http://timers.shop/Multi-Functional-Timers_c_15.html
Barry

"Take care, sir," cried Sancho. "Those over there are not giants but windmills".

2007 Patrol 100k km and counting,
2018 M70

Donbmw
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 306
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:47 pm
Location: Monroe, Louisiana, 71203

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by Donbmw » Fri Mar 08, 2019 8:40 pm

Follow up on the float fuel level sensor. Today I was down to about a gallon of fuel left in tank. Used a borescope to see if I coul see something that could keep the float stuck in the low fuel position. Could not see anything. Drained all the fuel and removed the tank. With switch in the on position and moving the tank so the float would be in the empty and full position. I found that the tank in a position that the float should give you a full tank and the fuel light out. It would the float would stick in the low fuel position. The float would stay in the low fuel position until gave the tank a bum. Then it would fall to the full tank position. I removed the float sensor and still could not see any reason for it to stick. What I did find with it not installed. With moving the sensor the slight angle to be as close to the position it is mounted in the tank. The float would not slide on its own to the full position. The float level sensor when installed looks to be about a 30* angle. After having the sensor out of fuel for a couple hours I found that the float would slide on the shaft and turn the light on and off with very little tilt from the low to full readings. The only thing I can come up with for this not working is the float seating in the fuel and swelling to let it stick. If it wasn’t such a pain in the a$$ to install and remove by the way this float sensor is made you could fine tune the float position closer to one gallon left and open the clearance of the float and shaft so it might not stick.
2015 Patrol, 1980 R65, 1982 R65 bought new, 1975 R 90/6, 1959TR3 Triumph

Don

User avatar
wooden nickel
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Hero of the Soviet Union - 2019
Posts: 2254
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:55 pm
Location: Louisville, KY 40216

Re: New float sensor for 2014 to 2017

Post by wooden nickel » Fri Mar 08, 2019 9:30 pm

Played it safe and canceled it, and ordered 5A timer
Neat timer. That ought to do it.
I may not be good, but I'm slow.
Nick
2014 M70 Retros, the sports car of Urals.

Post Reply